彎道內,二輪的說它的極限比四輪更高~各位的看法是? - 歐洲車
By Madame
at 2008-02-27T17:48
at 2008-02-27T17:48
Table of Contents
怎麼看這文都好像跟本版主旨不合~
所以要是真的違反版規就砍了吧~
硬要拉一點邊的話,
我的車是德國後驅車,之前的車是日系前驅車,
後驅的過彎能耐又比前驅好些,如果部品條件類似~
有車友覺得二輪的過彎極限能夠高於四輪的嗎?
單看極限的話,不考慮車種~
我個人的看法是只要避震ok,隨便一組好胎極限就能夠比二輪重機更高了吧?
但是重機版有幾位朋友好像堅持四輪因為車重等等的因素下極限較低~
我都懷疑是不是我對車暸的太少了~
※ 編輯: AAApeter 來自: 122.146.10.50 (02/27 17:49)
推 mouz:如果單看極限的話 F1的過彎極限應比MOTO GP高 02/27 17:49
→ mouz:因為空力套件的關係 空套可以把F1"壓"在地上 02/27 17:50
→ AAApeter:應該不必討論到f1或是gp之間的差異就足以評估才對啊~ 02/27 17:51
→ AAApeter:不過我自己是真的懷疑我自己的這個看法了~ 02/27 17:52
推 mouz:可是我覺得還是要分開討論 千萬跑車跟百萬跑車、一般房車 02/27 17:53
→ mouz:前後驅、避震 輪胎等等 要討論的因素太多 02/27 17:54
→ AAApeter:但是如果不管車種,只考慮能做到的極限~? 02/27 18:07
推 eddisonfzr:給個意見吧 國道上 我朋友大改haya跑給法拉力追 02/27 18:08
→ eddisonfzr:才沒幾秒 法拉力就跟丟了 另外一個例子 02/27 18:09
→ eddisonfzr:nsr250 跑給只做底盤的原廠k8 在山路 nsr250 被海放 02/27 18:10
→ stabber111:無聊耶 從superbike板戰到這裡來 02/27 18:11
→ AAApeter:也不是要戰,這邊單純是看看別人的看法~因為我自己也懷疑 02/27 18:11
→ AAApeter:假若nsr250提升彎道及線之後呢? 02/27 18:12
→ DB9:請問您開F1? ENZO? F430? 02/27 18:15
推 eddisonfzr:你可以找rossi 跟 舒馬赫 一個騎m1 一個開f1 02/27 18:16
→ eddisonfzr:然後來台灣跑環潭公路 或羅馬公路 或南橫 看誰輸誰贏 02/27 18:17
→ DYE:四輪的好一點的性能車彎中可以超過1G 兩輪的呢?? 02/27 18:18
→ DYE:頃角超過45度代表1G嗎?? 02/27 18:20
推 eddisonfzr:這樣說好了 如果今天 把重機引擎掛在f1車上 並且理想化 02/27 18:20
→ eddisonfzr:的把f1車種降到跟重機一樣重時 我想結果就很明顯了!! 02/27 18:21
→ AAApeter:eddisonfzr兄,講的是彎到極限你喇這麼多幹嘛~ 02/27 18:26
→ stabber111:樓上忘記把車手的品德算進去...鐵包人的優勢啊:p 02/27 18:26
→ AAApeter:DB9兄,我開啥車關彎到極限啥事? 02/27 18:27
→ stabber111:更正 是樓樓上y 02/27 18:27
→ stabber111:= =+ 02/27 18:27
→ AAApeter:車手品德根彎道極限有啥相關呢? 02/27 18:27
→ stabber111:四輪彎道可以逼車啊,反正擦到一下 二輪就倒了 02/27 18:28
→ AAApeter:討論極限當然是講獨走~ 02/27 18:30
推 reallocust:我以前在日本時聽過一點別人的心得,我還滿認同的..就是 02/27 18:31
推 eddisonfzr:推 逼車插一下 二輪就躺下 02/27 18:32
→ stabber111:獨走會有差別 又不是賽道 02/27 18:32
→ reallocust:F1和MotoGP比F1樂勝,但一般量產汽車和F1的差異度,和一 02/27 18:32
→ eddisonfzr:對不起喇太多老實說我投4輪一票 可能以前我haya沒玩好 02/27 18:32
→ AAApeter:獨走講的就是賽到獨走~國內的4s房車賽就是採獨走計時~ 02/27 18:34
→ reallocust:般普通機車和MotoGP的差異度,4輪界比2輪界會差更多, 02/27 18:33
推 stabber111:對不起喇太多老實說我投高鐵一票 可能以前我車沒開好 02/27 18:34
→ AAApeter:stabber111喇奇奇怪怪的這麼多就是要迴避彎道極限的問題 02/27 18:36
推 eddisonfzr:sat兄指的是 輪胎多就贏囉 02/27 18:36
推 reallocust:簡單說就是2輪構造較簡單,能變能搞的比4輪少 02/27 18:36
→ stabber111:彎道很多種,要看哪種彎啊 02/27 18:38
→ AAApeter:reallocust兄講的蠻好~ 02/27 18:38
→ stabber111:戰這個真的很沒意義 煮晚餐去 02/27 18:39
推 eddisonfzr:我有客人要賣車 我估車去 02/27 18:39
→ AAApeter:個人覺得哪一種彎都一樣~不過這是我個人看法而已 02/27 18:39
→ AAApeter:我洗車去~^^ 02/27 18:40
推 reallocust:不過最後還是推論不出到底量產機車和量產汽車誰開賽道 02/27 18:40
→ reallocust:較快,如以德國扭不停賽道來說,CBR重機也能做到4輪超跑 02/27 18:41
→ AAApeter:沒有限定一定要量產2輪或是4輪阿 02/27 18:42
→ reallocust:的成績...所以,我較相信..."人的能量決定車的力量" XDD 02/27 18:42
→ AAApeter:況且"彎道"不等於"完整賽道"~ 02/27 18:42
→ AAApeter:這樣講宋七力的車應該最快~~ 02/27 18:43
推 stabber111:推r大 所以G5最快 管你是超跑還是超重機都輸它XD 02/27 18:46
→ AAApeter:對了DYE大的才是正解,側向g值就可以解答一切了~ 02/27 18:49
推 eddisonfzr:你是說 有超能力快的像噴射機那台嗎 02/27 18:50
→ AAApeter:由彎道曲率半徑以及彎道中切線速率決定~側向g值終結嘴砲 02/27 18:54
推 eddisonfzr:g值是一樣重點 02/27 19:00
→ eddisonfzr:但是若少了輪胎磨擦力 極對抗側向外拋的力量 就不夠了 02/27 19:00
→ AAApeter:應該說側向G值就是一切變因的的最後結果吧~ 02/27 19:04
推 eddisonfzr:恩 小弟拙見 嘴砲居多 下臺一鞠躬 02/27 19:05
推 kevin880401:所以說誰可以用較大的G值過灣 誰就比較快對吧? 02/27 19:06
→ DYE:四輪可以加傢私增加下壓力 二輪可以彎中變換重心(側掛) ~~ 02/27 19:06
→ AAApeter:我覺得對耶~哪台車可以撐住最大的G值,就是極限比較高 02/27 19:07
→ AAApeter:我自己騎車卡普的時候,其實只是把大量的質量向內塞~ 02/27 19:08
→ AAApeter:讓轉動慣量減少以利過彎~但是是有限的~ 02/27 19:09
噓 CygnuxSR:版規一:僅討論歐系車及相關周邊事物,禁止無關文章 02/27 19:24
→ CygnuxSR:和『二輪』扯一起就違反版規了吧 (?) 02/27 19:26
推 tmomotoo:版規又沒說不能討論『二輪』歐洲車,有啥好噓 02/27 19:35
推 hiphopviva:這有啥好噓?有夠無聊 G值越大 極限越高本來就是這樣 02/27 19:45
推 doublefat:兩種都有不就知道了 "錢的份量決定車的力量" XDD 02/27 19:57
推 psilons:硬要比的話,要找馬力重量比相同的二輪四輪上賽道分別計時 02/27 20:16
→ psilons:然後從很多賽道的平均時間來再平均,才會準 02/27 20:17
→ DYE:如果馬力重量比差不多的 二輪的極速會少一點 ~~ 馬力小 02/27 20:20
推 kazami:我個人覺得 如果單顆輪胎抓地力一樣的話 四輪的過灣極限會 02/27 21:02
→ kazami:比較高 但一般房車跟重機比 應該是很多賽道都會輸吧 就算 02/27 21:04
→ kazami:彎道小輸 但直線加速差太多了 若一般房車跟一般速克達比我 02/27 21:04
→ kazami:就覺得還有得拼^^ 02/27 21:05
推 xxxEVA:其實可以比 唯一的標準就是速度而已 需控制的頂多就推重比 02/27 21:44
推 kevin880401:我記得top gear有一集拿Type R跟CBXXXX比 02/27 21:47
→ kevin880401:彎道的地方Type R慢慢跟上 直線被海放 02/27 21:47
→ kevin880401:不過那時候好像大家的回應都是二輪過彎怎麼可能比較慢 02/27 21:48
→ xxxEVA:比如說同推重比四輪極速高 原因是馬力大 馬力大是特性而已 02/27 21:47
→ xxxEVA:說啥下壓力 改裝啥的 那也都只是特性 比如人跟獵豹 02/27 21:49
→ xxxEVA:兩個都找很厲害的 人短跑必輸 長跑必贏 不必扯些有的沒的 02/27 21:50
→ CygnuxSR:t小弟真愛鑽牛角尖,你在此板有看過誰在討論二輪的? 02/27 21:55
→ CygnuxSR:請注意版名:European"Car"..car是什麼?是四輪!you know? 02/27 21:56
→ CygnuxSR:二輪管你是歐洲還大陸,沒看到biker或superbike版?! 02/27 21:57
→ CygnuxSR:一整個莫名其妙了...其他參數同等..只論彎道極限 02/27 21:58
→ CygnuxSR:四輪定比二輪高啊! 不曉得這到底有啥好爭議有的沒的? 02/27 22:00
推 xxxEVA:就是二輪版不認為彎道極限四輪定比二輪高啊 不然怎會吵到這 02/27 22:04
→ xxxEVA:不過本版第一條 "唯歐洲車部分所佔比例請勿過低。" 嗯嗯 02/27 22:06
→ DYE:開四輪的 一般人與技術最好的 彎中速度差距不大 02/27 22:08
→ DYE:二輪的騎士 相對上技術要求高得多 一般人離極限很遠 02/27 22:09
→ DYE:二輪騎士還是練技術比嘴砲重要~~因為我也跑過~~ 02/27 22:10
→ CygnuxSR:基本上那個騎士技巧算高超了個人覺得...(彎中飄移) 02/27 22:23
→ reallocust:此篇只可於推文中討論,禁回文~~~ 02/27 23:05
→ AAApeter:CygnuxSR兄,就是大車板很多人不同意你的看法 02/27 23:24
→ AAApeter:"只論彎道極限,定是四輪高"~引述你的話~他們不同意嘍 02/27 23:25
→ DYE:如果相等車重下 製造純彎道速度機器 四輪還是比較強的 02/27 23:33
→ DYE:就是不談下壓力 四輪在過彎的時候也可以假想成外側兩輪過彎 02/27 23:34
→ DYE:但是四輪的可以做到重心更低 且可以用方胎 02/27 23:35
→ DYE:就這兩點比 兩輪的在彎前與彎中要頃斜車身浪費時間 02/27 23:36
→ DYE:如果是談市售車 實在很難比較 02/27 23:37
→ ryono:再好的車 通通輸給台灣的坑洞道路,跟國道停車場 02/27 23:41
→ AAApeter:DYE大,講極限,何必限制市售車? 02/27 23:52
→ AAApeter:談論個極限,扯出一堆奇奇怪怪的跟及線不相關的,納悶中 02/27 23:53
推 xxxEVA:就像人兩腳獵豹四腳比短跑衝刺沒意義一樣 不想面對而已 02/27 23:57
→ AAApeter:不過蠻牛跟杜卡提的影片裡面,好像是2輪的過彎快耶? 02/28 00:03
→ AAApeter:莫非小徑髮夾彎其實是二輪比較快? 02/28 00:04
推 ForceImpulse:DYE大 四論 你說一般人與高手在彎中差距不大 那差距 02/28 00:09
→ ForceImpulse:不大 那是那邊有差距?總不會是直線吧 02/28 00:10
→ DYE:說四輪的差距不大 是對"二輪差距很大"相比較 02/28 00:16
→ DYE:又不是說沒差距 02/28 00:16
→ DYE:二輪騎士 是全身都要細微的控制著 02/28 00:18
→ AAApeter:關於影片小弟有再隔壁版寫一些看法,有興趣的再請討論~ 02/28 00:43
推 LanceLee:又是沒有意義的月經比較文............. 02/28 09:07
→ LanceLee:努力賺錢或是努力投胎去買台F1來開開還比較實在..XDD 02/28 09:08
推 kazami:F1是有錢就買的到的嗎?? 02/28 13:01
推 integra715:買卡丁車比較實在些~~~~ 02/28 13:12
推 iamsjkla:摩托車好玩 不過也沒有必要神話重車的性能吧 02/28 13:15
推 dimxkimo:好久 歐洲版沒這麼熱鬧 呵呵呵~~ 02/28 15:16
推 MansonShih:拿蠻牛出來..-.- 這種是超級有錢人跑車 不是超會跑的車 02/28 18:05
推 allenella:開GO-KART比較便宜啦 02/28 19:35
→ lifeenjoyer:請問輪椅可以算是四輪的嗎?我朋友坐輪椅過彎尬輸他國 02/29 00:21
→ lifeenjoyer:小姪子的捷安特,兩人都卯足勁..結論是二輪會贏 02/29 00:22
推 MansonShih:前提是...輪椅要歐洲製造的...XD 02/29 01:49
推 stabber111:聽說英國製造的輪椅還有避震XD 02/29 09:23
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